Inferno - Now You Own It - Your Reactions

[Nemesis]

I'm sorry Sky, but I think this is pure nitpicking - the Arrow be slightly zoomed, but in my view the CO image is not that dissimilar. I don't see any appreciable difference in brightness or sharpness. Both images show there is a pink light up in the rafters, both images show that she is wearing a white blouse and is holding a key chain in her hand. And I don't see that much grain in the CO's screenshot either.

[Nika]

Originally Posted by Nemesis

Ok Nika - you hate it. But what do you hope to accomplish from emphasizing this?

As Stephen rightly quoted Dalton "Opinions vary". We will have to agree to disagree. But it seems you will not be happy until you get everyone to agree that grain = film, DNR stinks, and Arrow's Inferno was a bad job. This is not about persuasion for you; it is complete and utter domination.

Sorry, it's not going to happen - as I've written previously, most critics were very happy with this transfer as were many posters on the board.

You may be a grain purist but I'm sorry the grain = film argument has not been won, not by a long shot. Quite simply, some people do not like grain even if it is authentic and presents the film in the form that it was supposed to be seen - they may not care if the film looks waxy, but to them it looks good. Look at some of the comments of Predator Ultimate on Amazon. For the reverse, some people hated the grain on the Ghostbusters blu. With such a division of views, DVD and Blu companies will have one heck of a time trying to please both sides.

And let me just say something about putting a version of a film out in the best form possible. The simple truth is this: Arrow went first with Inferno - it went first and most people were pretty pleased with the result. Let's even give it props that it was the first company in the UK to ever even release it on dvd!

Naturally, rival companies will then have the advantage as they will try to find ways of bettering the release, thereby raising the bar. CO will naturally try to better Arrow's release, and in turn BU will have its turn and try to better both releases. Most companies will always want to better the version out there - it's a fact of life.

And it's not exactly gone unnoticed that CO originally promised a September release which is now being pushed back even further. They no doubt waited for a frame of reference - the Arrow release - to work with and to look for things they could do better. At this point, I would not even be surprised if they pushed it back further to wait and see what the BU looks like.

However, what I can guarantee is that when BU makes its push, you will not see it bragging on forums or websites how better its release is, like CO is doing over Arrow. It will submit its version let the picture stand and then let the supporters and detractors fight it out. Both Arrow and BU released COTLD at around the same time - you did not see them pull these tactics on each other.

Another example is the recent version of Hausu - MoC released a dvd version earlier this year and Criterion is just releasing the Blu. If you look at dvdbeaver caps, the blu blows the dvd out of the water. But nevertheless, there is no sign of triumphalism on Criterion's part and many people who bought the dvd will either keep it and double dip, or upgrade. They enjoyed the dvd release for the time, then something better came along. You do not hear the sort of criticism from them that you are applying here.


And Nika, let me ask you one last question. Inferno is a masterpiece and Arrow has the privilege of releasing it - it is available in many stores and on many online outlets - which many people can enjoy. We can both agree to disagree about the PQ, but it is there on blu and dvd and that alone is a cause of celebration.

But please tell me - even if CO's Inferno turns out to have better PQ, what is the point if most people will not be able to see it? CO is pretty much an exclusive afficionado distributor from its current track record - it does not seem to sell in stores and seems to sell on only 4 or 5 online outlets - none of them big like Amazon de. It will not have mainstream appeal and only those in the know will know how to track it down. A case of elitism, at its worst.

As well as care and trying to gauge its cosumers, at least Arrow allows easy access to its products.

There some much nonsense in this post, including more than a dozen accusations of things I've never said or even implied, I don't know where to begin to debunk it all. Therefore I'm not even going to waste my time on it.

[vinncent]

Originally Posted by Nika

There some much nonsense in this post, including more than a dozen accusations of things I've never said or even implied, I don't know where to begin to debunk it all. Therefore I'm not even going to waste my time on it.

Are you for real? ;-)

[Stephen@Cult Labs]

Can we keep it friendly please people? The last few posts are getting a little antagonistic. Some people like the image on the Arrow disc and some people don't. Let's refrain from the little digs and move on.

[skyofcrack]

Originally Posted by Nemesis

I'm sorry Sky, but I think this is pure nitpicking - the Arrow be slightly zoomed, but in my view the CO image is not that dissimilar. I don't see any appreciable difference in brightness or sharpness. Both images show there is a pink light up in the rafters, both images show that she is wearing a white blouse and is holding a key chain in her hand. And I don't see that much grain in the CO's screenshot either.

The aspect ratio is non-negotiable. When companies alter a film from 1.85:1 to fit the 1.78:1 widescreen tv image, that is also unacceptable to me. The same companies allow 2.35:1 product to be released which have even more black are at the top and bottom of the screen. Who cares if there's a tiny sliver for a 1.85:1 film. It should be accurate.

Most remotes have their own zoom buttons on them. Give us the correctly framed film and let the idiots out there zoom to their hearts delight. Don't give me a pre-zoomed disc.

As for the brightness, look at Irene's face. Clearly, the CO cap shows more light on her face. The Arrow is much softer. Look at her hair. The zoom also makes everything bigger in the frame and softer.

[The Limey]

Personally I think any film distributor that slams another in the fashion that Camera Obscura have been doing with Arrow over Inferno is unprofessional, pure and simple. I have mentioned this earlier on another site but the commentary that accompanies those screen shots from Camera Obscura just defies belief.
Frankly as this is Camera Obscura providing the screen shots themselves, there is no way to ascertain whether or not they have deliberately chosen stronger scenes on their release against against weaker versions of the same on the Arrow disc.

Therefore, until we get independently customer posted caps as comparison of both releases, I am dismissing the Camera Obscura provided caps on the probability of being biased.

[Stephen@Cult Labs]

Originally Posted by The Limey

Personally I think any film distributor that slams another in the fashion that Camera Obscura have been doing with Arrow over Inferno is unprofessional, pure and simple. I have mentioned this earlier on another site but the commentary that accompanies those screen shots from Camera Obscura just defies belief.
Frankly as this is Camera Obscura providing the screen shots themselves, there is no way to ascertain whether or not they have deliberately chosen stronger scenes on their release against against weaker versions of the same on the Arrow disc.

Therefore, until we get independently customer posted caps as comparison of both releases, I am dismissing the Camera Obscura provided caps on the probability of being biased.

Exactly. As has been said many times before, while screencaps can be a fairly good indication of the quality of an image, You need to see a comparison between the moving images to be be able to accurately see any difference.

[broonage]

I have several incredible CO releases, I really appreciate them if their releases are somewhat expensive.
But echoing others, they shouldn't do comparisons like that, it seems well below the belt. Is it even legal?

For the Arrow disk haters, i've seen the comparisons. I have good eyesight and I can say there really is no need for this complaining. It seems to me that people are just not happy with incredible things these days. A Blu is out there for the world yet nitpicking individuals are looking for any excuse to put it down. There is nothing to complain about, the Arrow release looks amazing just as the CO will be. Personally I went for Arrow as I adore their releases and incredible packages. Really, £15 for an incredible BR is just unfathomable! I think we are spoilt these days and again some folks just can't be pleased with what they get.

Please, let's end this dialogue!

[vinncent]

Originally Posted by broonage

I think we are spoilt these days and again some folks just can't be pleased with what they get.

Exactly! A couple of months ago we didn´t even have a Inferno on BD...and now that we do people complaine! Incredible!

[Curious Goods]

Originally Posted by vinncent

Exactly! A couple of months ago we didn´t even have a Inferno on BD...and now that we do people complaine! Incredible!

And now we have two, so what is wrong with comparing them? Should we stick our heads in the ground?

I invested a lot of money in a HD beamer and surround system. When I buy a HD blu-ray (and replace my older dvd) I expect the best image (detail) possible. Clearly this is not the case with the Arrow (the image is cropped and it isn't as detailed). I know I said earlier that I preferred the soft image, but now I'm not that sure anymore. I've discussed the grain issue with some other blu-ray enthusiasts and they've convinced me it is a vital part.

Arrow's release is fine, but it isn't definitive by the looks of it. Although it has the better extras of the two (going over the Obscura list which looks like filler, a commentary by 'Film Historians' who had nothing to do with this movie? No thanks). However, I'm actually now considering selling my Arrow for the Obscura purely for the movie quality, which in the end what it's all about. I've given this a lot of thought over the last week, seeing more screenshot comparisons. I will await the Obscura review and price before I go ahead.