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Old 14th June 2011, 12:51 AM
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Default New York Ripper: The Gender Debate

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Originally Posted by tobiaswragg View Post
And yes, a commentary involving Calum Waddell would have been interesting.
You mean because he describes it as "a very poor movie and blatantly misogynistic"?!

Personally, I don't know if I want to watch this or not. As someone with a big interest in gender politics and horror and finally getting to see Fulci's films, I'd certainly find it interesting. But I don't think I'd like it, and I don't particularly enjoy watching things that (theoretically) fit Calum's and Kermode's descriptions.

(As an aside, I have a much MUCH bigger problem with Shameless' 'whores meet saws' tagline than I do with any actual Cult Labs FILM I've ever seen...)
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Old 14th June 2011, 05:24 AM
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Default New York Ripper

You're right Owls, in that the whole film has a very misogynistic view of gender politics. However watching the film last night I have to say that it does actually have some artistic merit even though the film as a whole is pretty distasteful.
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Old 14th June 2011, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by TheOwlsAreNotWhatTheySeem View Post
You mean because he describes it as "a very poor movie and blatantly misogynistic"?!

Personally, I don't know if I want to watch this or not. As someone with a big interest in gender politics and horror and finally getting to see Fulci's films, I'd certainly find it interesting. But I don't think I'd like it, and I don't particularly enjoy watching things that (theoretically) fit Calum's and Kermode's descriptions.

(As an aside, I have a much MUCH bigger problem with Shameless' 'whores meet saws' tagline than I do with any actual Cult Labs FILM I've ever seen...)
Now come on! With so much evil, atrocity and stupidity out there, the last thing I care about is a nasty (and catchy) tagline. To be honest, one of the reasons why I like Shameless releases are their funky taglines.

As for New York Ripper. It is indeed an evil and misogynic flick and it contains nasty and disgusting scenes. But that's the idea, I guess. Lucio Fulci didn't want to shoot a romantic comedy.

It's no film to watch with your spouse, though. Just imagine yourself coming to the bedroom with a bottle of champagne, happily stating "We really should get some rubber ducks for our bath, baby!". She'll not appreciate your gentleness but will get a cold shiver instead - as she is in fear of you breaking the bottle and....

As the movie is not for the squeamish, I recommend:

TO AVOID FAINTING
KEEP REPEATING,
IT'S ONLY A MOVIE
...ONLY A MOVIE
...ONLY A MOVIE
...ONLY A MOVIE



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Old 14th June 2011, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by TheOwlsAreNotWhatTheySeem View Post
You mean because he describes it as "a very poor movie and blatantly misogynistic"?!
Yes.
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Old 14th June 2011, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOwlsAreNotWhatTheySeem View Post
You mean because he describes it as "a very poor movie and blatantly misogynistic"?!

Personally, I don't know if I want to watch this or not. As someone with a big interest in gender politics and horror and finally getting to see Fulci's films, I'd certainly find it interesting. But I don't think I'd like it, and I don't particularly enjoy watching things that (theoretically) fit Calum's and Kermode's descriptions.

(As an aside, I have a much MUCH bigger problem with Shameless' 'whores meet saws' tagline than I do with any actual Cult Labs FILM I've ever seen...)
To be honest - time and the passing of years has softened me a lot on The New York Ripper. I'm even beginning to wonder if it's more of a comical send-up of the giallo as a whole. I have come to enjoy the movie quite a lot even thought the gender politics do get under my nose (the fact they ARE so misogynistic is what's led me to wonder if it's all just a joke)
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Old 14th June 2011, 12:24 PM
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Good to see you've getting into it a bit more, Calum.
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Old 14th June 2011, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by MikeOutWest View Post
You're right Owls, in that the whole film has a very misogynistic view of gender politics. However watching the film last night I have to say that it does actually have some artistic merit even though the film as a whole is pretty distasteful.
I'm hard pushed to consider NYR as being misogynistic. It chronicles the activities of a misogynist - I mean, the killer obviously hates women, so he's not going to be kind and gentle to his victims, is he? But, in all honesty, for the film to actually be misogynistic would mean that its sole remit as a film would be to get the viewer to hate women. Well, it doesn't really do that, does it?

I'm with Calum on this one, I've always felt that Fulci was poking fun at the genre by making such an over-the-top entry into the Giallo canon. With its trite dialogue, excessive violence, sleazy sexual deviance and a funky score, it just strikes me as Fulci saying 'What the hell, let's go all out and make the ultimate, excessive Giallo.' Although Giallo in Venice/Giallo a Venezia is also a contender for 'Most Extreme Giallo'.

Sorry for taking things off-topic, but it was an interesting point that I wanted to address.
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Old 14th June 2011, 03:13 PM
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That's an excellent point, Daemonia, and one I hadn't really considered before. Next I will watch New York Ripper, I'll bear that in mind and see if it makes as much sense as it does now.
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Old 14th June 2011, 03:49 PM
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That's an excellent point, Daemonia, and one I hadn't really considered before. Next I will watch New York Ripper, I'll bear that in mind and see if it makes as much sense as it does now.
Me too!

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Old 14th June 2011, 04:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Daemonia View Post
I'm hard pushed to consider NYR as being misogynistic. It chronicles the activities of a misogynist - I mean, the killer obviously hates women, so he's not going to be kind and gentle to his victims, is he? But, in all honesty, for the film to actually be misogynistic would mean that its sole remit as a film would be to get the viewer to hate women. Well, it doesn't really do that, does it?
Well, to be fair, misogyny (as a worldview) is not quite as simple as the film would need to make "the viewer hate women" which is entirely subjective and moves out of theorising and into a whole area of qualitative/ quantitative research based on audience reaction and the baggage they bring to it.

But anyway... I get enough of this in my PhD (*screams loudly and throws Kracauer at the wall*)

I digress: a film *can* hold a misogynistic worldview and it can also sexualise images that are inherently misogynistic: a naked woman tied to a bed with her nipple sliced in half for instance. The New York Ripper does both of these - which is why it has the reputation it has.

However, whether it is down to bad looping and some dubious acting I do not know - the film is also really funny and it feels like some kind of send-up with Fulci and the cast being "in on the joke". Sort of like Pieces in a sense - only with much more technical/ production values. The same cannot be said for more sterile and studied misogyny of something like the Halloween remake - which, if memory serves, had no BBFC problems at all. I do think Shameless got a bum deal from the BBFC.

And whilst Kermode, who I really like, did not think much of The New York Ripper he did defend Martyrs (which I hated) and was disgusted by The Devil's Rejects (which I thought was excellent) so you know the old saying about opinions and assholes...
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