The Cut Bits!

[karaman]

Why don't you make the missing scenes available for download? The scene in Venus in furs isn't important.It doesn't add anything to the movie.But I would be glad if you make the missing parts available for download.It wouldn't be logical to buy Italian cut for nearly 50 usd.

[vipco]

Out of the films now passed uncut would Shameless have accepted some of the previous bbfc cuts and released them in a fuller than before version like with NY Ripper and Venus or would they have not released them.
Also if the bbfc insisted that the cuts to Ripper be the same as the VIPCO version would Shameless have released it.

[vincenzo]

I compared the cut versions of both the Vipco (VHS) & Shameless releases of NYR. The cuts are very similar, though the Shameless edits are much more smoother. Some brief shots are slowed down and there are a couple of flash images (a slightly longer closeup of blood dripping from the razorblade) which weren't in the Vipco release.

The total given by the BBFC (34 secs) is completely wrong. 19 secs is definitely the correct figure. There simply wouldn't have been any point in the BBFC cutting it further this time around.

I was surprised about the length of the cuts to Venus In Furs. Especially as a similar (and far more explicit) 'pleasure rape' in Emmanuelle had recently (and finally) passed uncut.

[Angel]

Never seen the uncut Emmanuelle but if only the BBFC would bother replying via their email service we could find out the answer. I think it's quite frustrating when the BBFC cut a scene from a film only to pass a similar scene in another, but as they always have an answer to everything I would love to know the answer to this. Presumably though it wasn't their view that the woman in question was shown "enjoying" the rape otherwise they wouldn't have waived it. The type of cuts made to Venus in Furs are quite rare...only 2/3 films cut for this reason in the last 7years. There was a scene in Sinful Dwarf that appears to show something like this as well.

[vincenzo]

Late Night Trains has a similar scene (the toilet rape) which featured a pleasure rape. To be honest I expected trims to this, especially after the cutting of Venus In Furs, and was pretty amazed (and extremely pleased) that it got through intact.

It does also muddy the waters up a bit re BBFC policy on 'pleasure rape' scenes. I saw Emmanuelle on the flicks in the 80's and the rape scene was completely removed (the whole scene just ended abruptly). I have the uncut Optimum release and, although the scene isn't particularly graphic, it's fairly strong. I can only assume the BBFC waived it because of the context in which the rape is shown (Emmanuelle agrees to try rape to see if it satisfies her).

[Angel]

The scene was cut in 1978 because the BBFC thought it would fall foul of the OPA, which didn't apply to films before. Although when they cut the scene again in 2001 no mention was made of the OPA, now they cite the VRA as reason for the cuts. Presumably they passed it uncut in 2007 after being informed by their legal experts that a prosecution would now be highly unlikely.

[vincenzo]

So presumably the scene in Venus In Furs is cut because they believe a prosecution could be likely?

I'm surprised they didn't feel the same about Baise Moi or Irreversible.

[vipco]

Do you recon the BBFC are relaxing because of the times or the fact that film and game companies are more likely to fight a decision and not see the BBFC as something to be feared anymore .

How do Shamless and the BBFC get along. Is there any talk pre submission of a film to see were the censors are with that particular film or is it a submit and hope situation .
Shamless's record has been excellent so far, I hope they get the success they deserve as the UK market is strange as most collectors prefer to import and sort of look down on me for buying UK stuff.

[Angel]

Originally Posted by vincenzo

So presumably the scene in Venus In Furs is cut because they believe a prosecution could be likely?

I'm surprised they didn't feel the same about Baise Moi or Irreversible.

Well according to the BBFC, the scene in Venus was a clear infringement of the VRA. There was nothing in Baise Moi (cut version) or Irreversible that was illegal.

I don't know why they passed the scene in Night Train Murders, Vince, but if you were to ask them I guarantee they would hit you with a stunning reply. In the past I've asked them difficult questions but they always give a very reasonable explanation every time. There are a lot of questions I would still like to ask them today but they are very slow in relpying these days.

[Angel]

Originally Posted by vipco

Do you recon the BBFC are relaxing because of the times or the fact that film and game companies are more likely to fight a decision and not see the BBFC as something to be feared anymore .

How do Shamless and the BBFC get along. Is there any talk pre submission of a film to see were the censors are with that particular film or is it a submit and hope situation .
Shamless's record has been excellent so far, I hope they get the success they deserve as the UK market is strange as most collectors prefer to import and sort of look down on me for buying UK stuff.

I don't think it's anything to do with companies fighting decisions...in fact they rarely do. No company as far as I know has ever reversed the BBFC's decision as far as cuts are concerned in recent years. Certainly not compulsory cuts anyway. So fighting the BBFC's decisions re-cuts and rejections has not proven to have had much success. The BBFC know only too well that the public are sick to death of their decades of over the top censorship and are responding in the way they should have done many years ago. But of course had to wait until Ferman retired.

I think Shameless do well regarding cuts because, as Almar has said before, they only submit films that have a reasonable chance of passing. So August Underground would be out of the question.