The Cut Bits!
 

We've done rather well at pushing through films uncut for the first time in the UK but as we all know NYR and Venus in Furs got a wee bit shaved which rather peeved us 'cause when you hand over your £12.99 we'd like you to get the whole thing. :(

With that in mind here are those missing seconds for you good people! :)

http://www.shameless-films.com/2008/...e-cut-moments/

Eh I don't need to tell you these bits are graphic so if you're easily offended then... what are you doing on this forum? ;)

Hmm. The BBFC have always frowned upon blood on breasts in films, and also the fact that a woman could become receptive to a man during a sexual assault, but the Venus In Furs footage is no worse than the attack in Straw Dogs. The same goes for New York Ripper, had Scorsese or Spielberg felt the need to mutilate a womans breast and nipple the censors, sorry classifiers, would be a lot more receptive...

As a woman I have to say I didn't find the scene from Venus in Furs all that offensive. In fact, I didn't find it offensive at all. But is terribly kind of the BBFC to save me the trouble of finding this out for myself. The amusing thing is, if she were abused further and therefore punished for her enjoyment of the rape, the BBFC probably wouldn't have had a problem with the scene...

What a bunch of weirdos!

Great to watch the missing scenes and I was then really pissed off to find out how inoffensive they were!! Utterly unnecessary censorship :mad:
BBFC eh?...... Well done Rockstar Manhunt 2!!
Almar, ever thought of doing the same with NYR and VIF? ;)

I suspect any chance of success would be virtually zero.

Hence the ;)
;) (that one's for you)
;)

Shameless's track record at the BBFC is proving to be extremely promising.......

New York Ripper (Slightly less cut than before but this will always prove to be a difficult one with the BBFC - though the day will come.....)
Venus In Furs (Much less cut than before and only to 1 scene)
Late Night Trains (From a cinema rejection to an uncut release)
Phantom Of Death (Previous cuts waived)
Torso (Previous cuts waived)
Killer Nun (Previous cuts waived)
Flavia The Heretic (Previous cuts waived)
The Frightened Woman (Previous cuts waived)
My Dear Killer (Previous cuts waived)

That's pretty good by any standards. :)

Wholeheartedly agreed. I bloody love Shameless!! :cool:

It isn't a Franco film.

Sorry, I realised that before I went away last weekend and forgot to edit the post. Ooops my bad.

venus
 

Why don't you make the missing scenes available for download? The scene in Venus in furs isn't important.It doesn't add anything to the movie.But I would be glad if you make the missing parts available for download.It wouldn't be logical to buy Italian cut for nearly 50 usd.

Out of the films now passed uncut would Shameless have accepted some of the previous bbfc cuts and released them in a fuller than before version like with NY Ripper and Venus or would they have not released them.
Also if the bbfc insisted that the cuts to Ripper be the same as the VIPCO version would Shameless have released it.

I compared the cut versions of both the Vipco (VHS) & Shameless releases of NYR. The cuts are very similar, though the Shameless edits are much more smoother. Some brief shots are slowed down and there are a couple of flash images (a slightly longer closeup of blood dripping from the razorblade) which weren't in the Vipco release.

The total given by the BBFC (34 secs) is completely wrong. 19 secs is definitely the correct figure. There simply wouldn't have been any point in the BBFC cutting it further this time around.

I was surprised about the length of the cuts to Venus In Furs. Especially as a similar (and far more explicit) 'pleasure rape' in Emmanuelle had recently (and finally) passed uncut.

Never seen the uncut Emmanuelle but if only the BBFC would bother replying via their email service we could find out the answer. I think it's quite frustrating when the BBFC cut a scene from a film only to pass a similar scene in another, but as they always have an answer to everything I would love to know the answer to this. Presumably though it wasn't their view that the woman in question was shown "enjoying" the rape otherwise they wouldn't have waived it. The type of cuts made to Venus in Furs are quite rare...only 2/3 films cut for this reason in the last 7years. There was a scene in Sinful Dwarf that appears to show something like this as well.

Late Night Trains has a similar scene (the toilet rape) which featured a pleasure rape. To be honest I expected trims to this, especially after the cutting of Venus In Furs, and was pretty amazed (and extremely pleased) that it got through intact. :)

It does also muddy the waters up a bit re BBFC policy on 'pleasure rape' scenes. I saw Emmanuelle on the flicks in the 80's and the rape scene was completely removed (the whole scene just ended abruptly). I have the uncut Optimum release and, although the scene isn't particularly graphic, it's fairly strong. I can only assume the BBFC waived it because of the context in which the rape is shown (Emmanuelle agrees to try rape to see if it satisfies her).

The scene was cut in 1978 because the BBFC thought it would fall foul of the OPA, which didn't apply to films before. Although when they cut the scene again in 2001 no mention was made of the OPA, now they cite the VRA as reason for the cuts. Presumably they passed it uncut in 2007 after being informed by their legal experts that a prosecution would now be highly unlikely.

So presumably the scene in Venus In Furs is cut because they believe a prosecution could be likely?

I'm surprised they didn't feel the same about Baise Moi or Irreversible.

Do you recon the BBFC are relaxing because of the times or the fact that film and game companies are more likely to fight a decision and not see the BBFC as something to be feared anymore .

How do Shamless and the BBFC get along. Is there any talk pre submission of a film to see were the censors are with that particular film or is it a submit and hope situation .
Shamless's record has been excellent so far, I hope they get the success they deserve as the UK market is strange as most collectors prefer to import and sort of look down on me for buying UK stuff.

Well according to the BBFC, the scene in Venus was a clear infringement of the VRA. There was nothing in Baise Moi (cut version) or Irreversible that was illegal.

I don't know why they passed the scene in Night Train Murders, Vince, but if you were to ask them I guarantee they would hit you with a stunning reply. In the past I've asked them difficult questions but they always give a very reasonable explanation every time. There are a lot of questions I would still like to ask them today but they are very slow in relpying these days.

I don't think it's anything to do with companies fighting decisions...in fact they rarely do. No company as far as I know has ever reversed the BBFC's decision as far as cuts are concerned in recent years. Certainly not compulsory cuts anyway. So fighting the BBFC's decisions re-cuts and rejections has not proven to have had much success. The BBFC know only too well that the public are sick to death of their decades of over the top censorship and are responding in the way they should have done many years ago. But of course had to wait until Ferman retired.

I think Shameless do well regarding cuts because, as Almar has said before, they only submit films that have a reasonable chance of passing. So August Underground would be out of the question.

Well when we picked our initial batch of films there was almost universal agreement that none would get though uncut but we figured you have to break some eggs to make an exploitation omelette...

We wouldn't try and put through something we thought had no chance on getting through uncut but there has to be some risk - it's just trying to be calculated about it. We can ask the BBFC informally but there's no guarantee that will translate into the decision we want. Our problem unlike the majors is once we've submitted a film by which time you've bought it and paid for it to all go ahead we have to release it to recoup - we can't just sit on it or it would kill us.

Interestingly NYR is uncut but has sold nearly twice as many as the next nearest title and we've not hidden the fact it's uncut - in fact we've even managed to make it sound more uncut than it is! :(

I can only assume their policy on certain elements of hardcore has also changed. There were scenes in Baise Moi that I never thought I'd ever see in an 18-rated film. I wonder what the average film fan would find more shocking. Venus In Furs or Baise Moi (even in it's barely cut UK version).

The BBFC are still slow to reply to me too. :(

Isn't that cos it's actually cut? (though only just). http://shameless-films.com/forums/im...es/biggrin.gif

aS I'VE SAID BEFORE,THE PLASTIC NIP SLICING DOESN'T DETRACT ANY,and it's the crispest looking transfer yet:cool:So good i sold my uncut AB version for a daft amount on amazon;)
See,i done my own little bbfc excercise,watched both versions,and as i said above,the nip scene isn't shocking,it's phoney looking and ludicrous....the way Shameless have intercut the bird screaming with Hedley in the phonebox is actually more disturbing.......imagination....what you thought you've seen?

I hope so.I want to download them to my computer and then record to a :cool:CD.

Warning:copyright exists in the .............:jest:

We're looking into making the clips available as a download. Watch this space.

Dinnae worry aboot it Almar......;)

venus in furs
 

Is " Venus in Furs" uncut except that 1 min rape scene?

It is uncut apart from that scene - we only cut what the BBFC asked for - not a second more - and we never would!

Almar, if you picked up the rights to a movie that had been passed by the BBFC for its previous holders uncut, say 10 years ago, do you have to resubmit it again as the new owner or does the initial classification stand.?
Also if the previous classification stand s, do you have to notify the BBFC of the re rerelease .?
Not important, Just curious.

I think it has to be resubmitted to the BBFC as a Change Of Distributor.

Yes that's true although the BBFC don't actually view the film again if it is exactly the same as before, but it still has to be re-submitted. Unfortunately because the BBFC rate the film as before it means that if the film now only merits a 15 rating (when it was previously 18) it will still be rated 18. I'm pretty sure this is what happened with the 60's film The Killers that was rated 18 again recently even though it could easily have passed with a 15 now. Terror Train is another example rated 18 but could easily have passed 15 as it is very tame. There has now been a change of policy at the BBFC which means that if a film is re-submitted it will be classified according to the standards currently operating. I'm very eager to see if they will up grade Jaws to a 12. Hope they don't but they might.

Is a fee involved for resubmitting due to change of distributor .?
I take it any extras would have to be classified if they were added to the disc thus costing the new distributor if they wanted to add cinema trailers for the film even though these trailers would have a theatrical classification by the BBFC but not a home one.

I don't think there is a fee. Might be wrong though. Marc or Almar would know for sure.

Thanks Vince :)

Cheers Vince, I always wondered how much the bbfc charged for various services. Bloody Gangsters.

I'd be interested to know if the only fault found was the cut scene.

I, for one, always ignore customer reviews on Amazon. I've learned that people rarely leave reviews if they are happy, but they nearly always review if they're not. So customer reviews are never balanced.

I'd like to think that most people would just be happy these films are getting released.

Why leave a remark on a marketplace that will damage a company that works its ass off to bring the films the fans want that no one else will touch.
Shameless work hard to get these films out in top quality, uncut or fullest UK version available and Shameless should be applauded for the work they do not slated Karaman.

Keep up the good work Almar , its appreciated mate.

I am happy to see these titles are being released.But i am not living in UK.And i have no connection with BBFC.If i wish,i can buy Italian version or Japanese version.I wanted to buy an uncut version.I had thought that the censoured scene was an important one.But after watching it i changed my mind.I also deleted my review on amazon.uk.I will also buy "The frightened woman"-dvd.