Cannibal Ferox /Bloody Moon

[Angel]

Yes they do cut a lot of R18's, that's partly because of the huge number submitted to them. Last year over a thousand films were rated R18. Cuts are generally made due to the current interpretation of the OPA.

[vipco]

Thankyou both for taking the time to explain the BBFC policies and the R18.
I was unaware it was a porn only rating as porn is something I really hate, so i'd saw the rating on the BBFC list of classifications but had never seen a video/dvd with thie R18 symbol before .

I asked about the Hi Def thing as I rember reading an article in Darkside ages ago that some film was passed uncut by darkening certain scenes thus making them less explicit and therefore acceptable to the BBFC.
I just wondered if the clarity of certain imagery would cause new problems with the censors , bit silly now I think about it.

[steve]

Very enjoyable discussion going on here at the moment.

As much as I think I know about film and censorship there's always more to learn and discover and I think it's wonderful hearing other opinions and theories.

I agree with the censorship of animal cruelty and sexual violence (especially if it's shot in a way to make it 'sexy') because who actually wants to see that kind of thing? I think censorship can work but it's terribly frustrating when, sometimes, things are cut whilst other similar scenes get through without any fuss.

The BBFC has become incredibly relaxed over the past couple of years and I think it's a good thing. It would appear that the organisation has given credit to people and allowed them to make up their own minds. I am sure that there have been many discussions over particular scenes and whether to cut them or not.

All very interesting.

[Angel]

Originally Posted by steve

I agree with the censorship of animal cruelty and sexual violence (especially if it's shot in a way to make it 'sexy')

I also agree.

Originally Posted by steve

I think censorship can work but it's terribly frustrating when, sometimes, things are cut whilst other similar scenes get through without any fuss.

Which films are you referring to Steve?

[vipco]

While I dislike animal cruelty too Steve, I don't see why scenes of cock fighting, bull fighting etc should be cut as in some countries they're sports. We don't censor scenes of pheasant being shot so what makes these 'blood sports' different than any other.

I agree with what Angel mentioned earlier about horse falls . I remember a pre cert euro western were the cruelty to the horses was disgusting. Really vicous tear marks from spurs and one horse was knocked to the ground and stabbed with a spear by someone , and it was no FX job. Its good to see this treatment of horses being reconised for the cruelty it is.

I don't see most of the animal scenes in the cannibal films as cruel, as the animals were butchered in a humane way by someone who knew what they were doing, and not tortured. plus all the animals were eaten by the Indios, so whats the BBFC's problem. They can show civilised gentry blast birds but not indigenous tree people hunt local food. Deodato claims only 1 monkey was killed on his direction as the scene didn't turn out how he wanted so he asked the Indios to catch another monkey.
If an animal is killed humanely and not tortured then why does the BBFC get so hot and bothered.
They allowed slaughterhouse footage in LHODES and Cannibal Man so why not the way the jungle dwellers slautgher their food. I found the scene of the cow in Dead End Street more cruel than anything in Ferox.

Do the BBFC really believe that wildlife film makers just 'happen' to be there when a lion kills.
Im not saying that techniques used in MONDO movies are still used today but there is bound to be some kind of 'help' to make sure they get the money shot, and the BBFC know it.

[vincenzo]

I agree with the cutting of animal cruelty when the intention was/is to genuinely injure, maim or kill an animal for the sake of 'entertainment'. I just find it pointless. Cannibal Holocaust for example made its point superbly and chillingly without the need for animal killings.

Unless the footage of sexual violence is genuine and not staged then I see no reason to cut it. The participants have a choice as to whether to take part (unlike the animals).

[vipco]

I agree with you on staged sexual violence as long as its not designed to be a 'turn on' but part of the story, but fail to see how the animal scenes in Holocaust offended you if sexual violence didn't .
Surely exploiting one of the most terrible things that can happen to a women or man, violent rape , and pushing the censor to the point were the interpretation of it is that offensive it has to be banned, is far worse than showing a monkey being killed for the purpose they were intended, food.
Monkey's etc are the stable diet of some indegious tribes of the Amazon and the filming of them going about their everyday task of killing such food is not IMO cruel, just life.
The animals weren't tortured, they were killed and eaten much quicker than they would be in a 'civilized' werstern world slaughterhouse .
I agree the that staged animal fight scenes should be banned as that is cruel but theres no cruelty in natives hunting and killing their prey.

[vincenzo]

The rape scenes etc in Holocaust didn't offend me (though the footage is certainly disturbing) because they were just actors/actresses wearing makeup and playing a role, however realistic the scenes may be. The animal footage was genuine and they were killed for the sake of a movie. The horrific turtle mutilation is also done by the American film team, rather than the natives.

If stock footage from nature documentaries is used then I see no reason to cut it. The UK Animals Act generally covers staged scenes of animal cruelty or violence anyway.

[vipco]

Yes vince, I thought the turtle scene was totally appalling and had no point other than to show how vicious the lost team of film makers were , but as this is displayed in many different ways thoughout the film then that scene was for basic shock value, nothing else, and totally unnecessary .
Its been a while from I watched my uncut version as its VHS (Dutch) but apart from the turtle and the Muskrat/knife scene , I find the rest of the film to be an acceptable protryal of jungle life, and not cruel . . I know a pig gets shot but I also remember reading that it was quite tasty , as the main location was only accessible by small plane so it was a welcome meal for cast and crew.
I just think the BBFC could pass Holocaust minus those two scenes , but use animal cruelty laws to wiggle out of it.

[vincenzo]

It's certainly a subject that offers many different viewpoints and mucho debate. I end up contradicting myself all the while when it comes to Cannibal Holocaust when I say that, although I generally oppose censorship, I have no problems with the cutting of the animal cruelty in it.

No wonder this is classed as one of the most controversial movies ever made. The arguments for/against the film are so diverse.